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Old 09-08-2008
 
#61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elcapjtk View Post
Rape is sex without consent. If you can't consent, it's rape. "I'm too drunk" is not consent, being passed out is not consent. Slipping a roofie into a girls drink is not "violent" at all.
There is something known as "implicit consent." For instance when I fuck my wife it's implied that she is giving consent even when she doesn't verbally state "it's ok for you to fuck my brains out." Likewise, if a girl is drunk but doesn't physically or verbally resist (aside from being unconscious) then she is giving implied consent. Simply regretting sex after the fact does not constitute rape, rather is constitutes poor judgment.

Drugging a girl is different because she did not consent to being drugged, whereas she did consent to drinking. Same with being passed out, she is physically unable to give consent. I don't see how you could argue that being drunk is the same as being passed out. You can drive, fight, have sex, read, write, and plethora of other things while drunk, albeit with less capacity. What can you do while passed out?

Quote:
Originally Posted by elcapjtk
As for underage sex, or statutory rape, the title applies because until you're an adult in the eyes of the government you do not have the ability to consent. Kids and teenagers CANNOT be trusted to make good, logical descisions, especially when it comes to sex and the implications thereof.

Given that "adults" can't seem to make rational decisions on sexuality, how can you expect teenagers to do the same? The consent is void because the teen cannot give consent, for the same reason a teen can't sign a binding contract without a parent or guardian's consent.

Case in point.
In that case children should never, under any circumstances, be charged as adults using the same logic. If a kid goes in to school and shoots up his classmates he should be charged as a minor because he's not old enough to give consent to shooting up his classmates, right?

This makes you wonder if the kid should be charged at all since we are arguing that they have no capacity to make decisions for themselves. Should kids be charged with crimes? Do they have capacity for decision-making?
 

Last edited by Neo; 09-08-2008 at 04:21 PM. Reason: that was elcap -- not me!
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Old 09-08-2008
 
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Originally Posted by Donald Rumsfeld View Post
In that case children should never, under any circumstances, be charged as adults using the same logic. If a kid goes in to school and shoots up his classmates he should be charged as a minor because he's not old enough to give consent to shooting up his classmates, right?

This makes you wonder if the kid should be charged at all since we are arguing that they have no capacity to make decisions for themselves. Should kids be charged with crimes? Do they have capacity for decision-making?
Well elcap has just explained and you realize as well why we have separate ways of dealing with crimes committed by minors and adults. It makes sense, according to the logic presented above.

But with regard to the question of whether the kid should be charged at all, I think you can make a distinction between shooting up a school and entering into a contract or having sex. The distinction here being that in the latter cases, a clear line can be drawn to a particular party who is in a position to take advantage of the child's impaired decision-making abilities, whereas in the former case this is not possible, since his decision to kill, if not entirely independent (which is possible) was based on influences that are much more spread out .


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Old 09-08-2008
 
#63
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I disagree though, because those kids who have sex with their teachers know exactly what they are doing. I don't think the teachers "force" or "coerce" them in any way, much like society doesn't "force" kids to shoot up schools.

I think you guys are just looking for someone to blame. You can't point the finger at "society" because that includes you and what not, but you can blame the teacher because you're not the teacher. What ever happened to personal responsibility? And besides, how is the kid harmed?
 
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