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Old 07-10-2008
 
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Default Suggestion: Mystical Item for Respecing

I posted this on the bnet forum as well, but I want to know what you guys think. Plus, that's likely to be attacked by spammers/threadbreakers/troll posts etc. anyway.


I don't so much like the idea of an easy way out of a poor decision in creating your character.

However, I agree that there needs to be some sort of addition which allows some players who wanted to experiment with something new be able to fix their character.

So, My suggestion:

I think there should be some sort of mystical item, that can be taken to a character in every town.

This mystical item will allow you to make a small set amount of skill point changes when taken to that town character.

This item would be rare to find in game.

I think this would be the easiest way to work the respecing system, which makes a player play the game for a set amount of time, trying to find this mystical item so they can fix a mistake they've made.

It allows them a little punishment for the decision they made, which is maybe a few additional hours of playing(somewhat punishment, since time is so important nowadays), and allows the opportunity to fix that mistake.

BTW: This shouldn't be an item able to be traded...

I am hoping maybe to get a response, however, considering its a suggestion and which forum its on, it's not likely to get a blizz response. If there is one, I'll post it here in the OP.

Give some input guys, what do you think?
 

Last edited by Santrega; 07-10-2008 at 02:34 PM.
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Old 07-10-2008
 
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IMO If that item can be used only once i think it is too limited, and if it could be used any number of times then it makes anyone who finds it able to respec as much as he wants which is unbalanced.

Besides, i don't really want to see character-bound items in D3, it limits trade ( unless that item is an exception )

I think a respec system using gold will give gold a great value in both singleplayer and multiplayer.

It would work in a way that with each respec for one point the cost increases, first time you go to the NPC that respecs for you it costs 100,000 ... next time with the same character costs 500,000 ... the next time 2,000,000 ... and so on.

Benefit:-
-Gives gold great value in trade
-Enables multiple times of respec but punishes the player by increasing the cost exponitionaly limiting its use to ony when it is really needed.
-Done thourgh an NPC in each town, meaning you can't respec anywhere.

---------------------------------------------------------------------

That's my idea about a respec system, if you like it i hope you post it on Bnet along with your idea, the Devs might read them both and make something good out of them
 
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Old 07-10-2008
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KnightWolf View Post
IMO If that item can be used only once i think it is too limited, and if it could be used any number of times then it makes anyone who finds it able to respec as much as he wants which is unbalanced.

Besides, i don't really want to see character-bound items in D3, it limits trade ( unless that item is an exception )

I think a respec system using gold will give gold a great value in both singleplayer and multiplayer.

It would work in a way that with each respec for one point the cost increases, first time you go to the NPC that respecs for you it costs 100,000 ... next time with the same character costs 500,000 ... the next time 2,000,000 ... and so on.

Benefit:-
-Gives gold great value in trade
-Enables multiple times of respec but punishes the player by increasing the cost exponitionaly limiting its use to ony when it is really needed.
-Done thourgh an NPC in each town, meaning you can't respec anywhere.

---------------------------------------------------------------------

That's my idea about a respec system, if you like it i hope you post it on Bnet along with your idea, the Devs might read them both and make something good out of them
I do like your idea as well..

But, what I suggested won't only be able to be used just once ...

The way it works is the item disappears after use, and has to be found again.

All the official numbers are depending on balance though... But what I was thinking is as follows:

When you find one, you can make 3-5 changes. The way the changes work are simple...

You simply use the item to remove those skill points, and after the max amount of skill points has been removed, or when you click the "Done" option, you will then be allowed to add those skill points you removed elsewhere.

The mystical item then disappears, and has to be found again to make any further changes.

All the specifics are subject to balance though...
 
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Old 07-10-2008
 
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its not a bad idea..

and if the item is fully tradable, in that you can find / trade how many you want without first using the one you have, "the market" will set a price for the item....


the gold idea works too, but i dont really believe in endless exponential growth of gold-cost.



since they've said their aiming for it, im sure they'll come up with something clever, sooner or later.
 
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Old 07-10-2008
 
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I found something good over a discussion in WoW D3 forums


Quote:
From: Re: Skill respecs? No thanks. 07/10/2008 03:21:57 PM PDT
By: Trawgdor

Imo, it should be Titan Quest style of respeccing; pay a trainer in a town to unlearn skills, each skill point you unlearn costs x amount of gold and for every point you unlearn, the amount of gold needed for the next skill costs more to unlearn. Eventually, you wont be able to respec due to each point costing some absurd amount of money.
It seems like the system has already been in Titan Quest, so i'm sure Blizz will consider it even more now, Since it will give Gold a real great value which is one of the things the Devs are aiming at.

Like ... i will sell this rare rune in an auction to other players so that i can get 1,000,000 quickly cause i need to respec my Barb.

Other Limitations on Respecing could also be:

-Only able to re-invest respeced points at the next Lv.Up
-Can only Respec three skill points each time.
 
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Old 07-10-2008
 
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I don't get it. What do you seem to have against being able to respec indefinately? I mean, in the end there will still probably only be a few viable builds, and punishing a player for not hoarding skill points seems rather silly.

Besides, even if they, for example, had a hammerdin and made it into a zealot, they'd still have to get new items for him (which they might have on a mule somewhere). The only thing that respecing does is saves people the trouble of grinding their heads off getting a character to level 70 again.

I don't like the idea of an item that you have to grind to hell to get enough of, and in the end it would probably be less time consuming to just run a character back up to level whatever. And as for exponentially rising gold costs, it's fine at first, but it seems unnecessary. Gold for time? It does add value to it, but at some point you can't use it anymore, and I don't like that in games.

Also, it murders single-player gamers. They generally have less time, and have the most need to splash skills here and there, especially early-game. Just saying.

From all the options my limited non-game developer mind can come up with,
 
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Old 07-10-2008
 
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I've been thinking... what about creating a salable item called a 'Potion of Forgetting' which allows you to unlearn the last few skill points you spent? Of course, there'd be varying qualities which unlearn between 1 to 10 points (with 10 being the maximum points you can unlearn). This way, it allows for slight modifications of your character and doesn't completely punish a player for simple mistakes yet prevents players from completely respeccing from the ground up.
 
 

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Old 07-10-2008
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimberson View Post
I don't get it. What do you seem to have against being able to respec indefinately? I mean, in the end there will still probably only be a few viable builds, and punishing a player for not hoarding skill points seems rather silly.

Besides, even if they, for example, had a hammerdin and made it into a zealot, they'd still have to get new items for him (which they might have on a mule somewhere). The only thing that respecing does is saves people the trouble of grinding their heads off getting a character to level 70 again.

I don't like the idea of an item that you have to grind to hell to get enough of, and in the end it would probably be less time consuming to just run a character back up to level whatever. And as for exponentially rising gold costs, it's fine at first, but it seems unnecessary. Gold for time? It does add value to it, but at some point you can't use it anymore, and I don't like that in games.

Also, it murders single-player gamers. They generally have less time, and have the most need to splash skills here and there, especially early-game. Just saying.

From all the options my limited non-game developer mind can come up with,

Indefinite respecing takes absolutely all thought out of making a good character. Diablo has always been about the challenge of not only getting the perfect items for your character, but also building your character perfectly to what you want it to be.

Indefinite respecing means no matter what you do to your character, it just doesn't matter. You basically will only need one character, and just constantly change what it is, rather than starting over with the same character and going down a different path.

It will take the replayability out of the game, and at the same time make every character decision meaningless.

I'm sorry, but I don't like to play games where my knowledge, understanding, and skill in a game means nothing.
 
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Old 07-11-2008
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KnightWolf View Post
IMO If that item can be used only once i think it is too limited, and if it could be used any number of times then it makes anyone who finds it able to respec as much as he wants which is unbalanced.

Besides, i don't really want to see character-bound items in D3, it limits trade ( unless that item is an exception )

I think a respec system using gold will give gold a great value in both singleplayer and multiplayer.

It would work in a way that with each respec for one point the cost increases, first time you go to the NPC that respecs for you it costs 100,000 ... next time with the same character costs 500,000 ... the next time 2,000,000 ... and so on.

Benefit:-
-Gives gold great value in trade
-Enables multiple times of respec but punishes the player by increasing the cost exponitionaly limiting its use to ony when it is really needed.
-Done thourgh an NPC in each town, meaning you can't respec anywhere.

---------------------------------------------------------------------

That's my idea about a respec system, if you like it i hope you post it on Bnet along with your idea, the Devs might read them both and make something good out of them
I really really like this idea, gold was more or less useless aside from repairing and gambling in D2
 
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Old 07-11-2008
 
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how about the gold-cost system with a cap on the max cost, at a couple of million or something.

to make it possible to respec more, eventually, if you really want to.... over time / with great investment.
 
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Old 07-11-2008
 
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I don't think a total respec is likely. As Bashiok mentioned, respecing isn't likely to be liberal, complete or easily accessible. As such, I think my suggestion of a Potion of Forgetting is most in line since it only allows a limited amount of skill backtracking. This works as it allows players to experiment and it doesn't punish players for making mistakes (having to rebuild your skill tree from scratch for accidentally clicking the wrong skill could be seen as a punishment too).
 

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Old 07-11-2008
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mr. peasant View Post
I don't think a total respec is likely. As Bashiok mentioned, respecing isn't likely to be liberal, complete or easily accessible. As such, I think my suggestion of a Potion of Forgetting is most in line since it only allows a limited amount of skill backtracking. This works as it allows players to experiment and it doesn't punish players for making mistakes (having to rebuild your skill tree from scratch for accidentally clicking the wrong skill could be seen as a punishment too).

The item idea is nice, but it depends on how you obtain it, if it can be bought it will be too easy to respec with no drawbacks, and if it is a rare drop it won't be a good idea to make an element of the gameplay formula only available through rare drops.

I'd choose the first choice if you can only respec for a limited number of times, like after using the potion ten times you are unable to use it again on the same character.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------


Still, i think that the Gold system in Titan Quest can be upgraded and used in D3, the benefits are many and will enhance the whole game experience not just the skill tree aspect.

Quote:
how about the gold-cost system with a cap on the max cost, at a couple of million or something.

to make it possible to respec more, eventually, if you really want to.... over time / with great investment.
Good point, i'd say at each difficulty there would be a higher Cap

-Normal -> 2,000,000
-Nightmare -> 8,000,000
-Hell -> 36,000,000

Hardcore -> No respecs needed

Now let's sum this up

Benefits of respec Gold system
-Ability to respec at an increasing cost
-Gives gold a great value and integrates in in Trade and Auctions
-Done thourgh an NPC in each town, meaning you can't respec anywhere.

Limitations on Respecing could also be:

-Only able to re-invest respeced points at the next Lv.Up
-Can only Respec three skill points each time.
-Cap limit increases with diffculty

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Now it would be nice if someone posts the Item and the Gold ideas on B.net
 
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Old 07-13-2008
 
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Not a fan- I still say once per difficulty, like the socket quest in D2.
 
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Old 07-16-2008
 
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ditto on Eli's suggestion as it being a quest reward and once per difficulty.

Anymore and anymore based on gold is unnecessary. Personally i'd prefer even a total of only 1 respecs, since it can be easy to misplace points when you're first playing a character.

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