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Thread: Why isn't Crystal Mangum in prison?

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    Default Why isn't Crystal Mangum in prison?

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2006_Du..._lacrosse_case

    6-8 years is fair in my opinion. I believe that any woman who falsely accuses someone of rape should have to serve the mandatory minimum for whatever they accused the person of. What are your thoughts?

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    Default Re: Why isn't Crystal Mangum in prison?

    Old news.
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    Default Re: Why isn't Crystal Mangum in prison?

    Do you agree that she should be in prison right now?

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    Default Re: Why isn't Crystal Mangum in prison?

    Three to four.

    Can't you be charged for false accusation? I'm sure there are parameters for sentencing if there is.
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    Default Re: Why isn't Crystal Mangum in prison?

    They are rarely if ever followed and the women always get off with a slap on the wrist. I think there should be mandatory minimum sentences for false rape accusations.

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    Default Re: Why isn't Crystal Mangum in prison?


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    Default Re: Why isn't Crystal Mangum in prison?

    The principles upon which the United States are founded assume the basic equality of all citizens. On these grounds, DE is not being unreasonable.

    The principles upon which the United States are founded are for the most part a whole lot of stupid enlightenment bullshit that nobody would take seriously if applied to their logical conclusions. We ignore them every day because while its nice in high rhetoric, trying to live according to that stupid nonsense would make our society a nightmare. Women should be given preferential treatment by the law on the issue of rape. Any law code that treats its citizens as equals is in its very founding setting itself against the conditions of objective reality, and so must either operate in contradiction of its founding principles or cease to function.
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    Default Re: Why isn't Crystal Mangum in prison?

    That's what drugs does to you, destroys your decision making capability and distorts reality--this woman may have acted in malice or simply in stupidity. It's clear that this case was mishandled by the D.A., and thus why he was disbarred and fired. He was literally fueling this case through lying and misrepresentation, and made it the circus that it became. Otherwise, attempting to prosecute women that are unable to substantiate their claims would lower an already ridiculously low number of reports. Who'd want to come forward and suffer the pain and embarrassment associated with having been raped, only to turn around and get prosecuted because there is a lack of evidence?
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    Default Re: Why isn't Crystal Mangum in prison?

    Quote Originally Posted by GenocideAlive View Post
    That's what drugs does to you, destroys your decision making capability and distorts reality--this woman may have acted in malice or simply in stupidity. It's clear that this case was mishandled by the D.A., and thus why he was disbarred and fired. He was literally fueling this case through lying and misrepresentation, and made it the circus that it became. Otherwise, attempting to prosecute women that are unable to substantiate their claims would lower an already ridiculously low number of reports. Who'd want to come forward and suffer the pain and embarrassment associated with having been raped, only to turn around and get prosecuted because there is a lack of evidence?
    Would your position remain the same if the alleged perpetrator (in this case, actually the victim of the woman, who is the actual perpetrator) was sent to prison for 20 years?

    "Whoops, sorry about that. But hey, we don't want to prevent real rape victims in the future from coming forward, so we aren't going to prosecute this woman."

    Not only would that person be justified in killing this woman when he got out, but also people like yourself who allowed that situation to come about with your anti-moral views. But that's just my opinion.

    I think it's always funny every time we have these "sexual assault" prevention briefings in the Army that bring up random statistics about rape not going reported. If 1/2 of all rapes aren't reported....how do we even know they occurred at all?

    She "may have" been stupid or "may have" lied about the whole thing. Give me a break. The bitch made the whole fucking thing up and could have costs 8 young men their freedom and dignity. For that she deserves to forfeit her own.

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    Default Re: Why isn't Crystal Mangum in prison?

    Quote Originally Posted by GenocideAlive View Post
    That's what drugs does to you, destroys your decision making capability and distorts reality--this woman may have acted in malice or simply in stupidity. It's clear that this case was mishandled by the D.A., and thus why he was disbarred and fired. He was literally fueling this case through lying and misrepresentation, and made it the circus that it became. Otherwise, attempting to prosecute women that are unable to substantiate their claims would lower an already ridiculously low number of reports. Who'd want to come forward and suffer the pain and embarrassment associated with having been raped, only to turn around and get prosecuted because there is a lack of evidence?
    I know, months behind.

    I get your point, here, GA, but certainly you feel that this case is more than just the prosecution lacking evidence - they lied through their teeth for months, and we all know about it. These people were completely dedicated to imprisoning and crucifying an entire group of well-to-do college kids for mere financial gain and fame. It's a disgusting and dangerous act which deserves just punishment, particularly for the accuser, who was allowed to continue her life as she saw fit. Bullshit. That lady should still be working towards her police psychology degree from a prison cell.

    Crystal Mangum and Friends didn't just have insufficient evidence for crimes committed against her - the crimes themselves never even happened. The accusations themselves held very real consequences for those on their receiving end, never mind the devastation a guilty verdict would have been to those people and their families. It just seems that you're trying to trivialize the seriousness of this case by suggesting that holding the woman accountable for this would undermine future, legitimate cases.

    Of course, not treating her as the deranged criminal that she is for this case, Crystal Mangum has been allowed to go on thinking she was untouchable, and now she's being charged for murder. What a winner.
    Last edited by Kaervek; 02-23-2010 at 03:28 PM.
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    Default Re: Why isn't Crystal Mangum in prison?

    You're jumping to some rather bold conclusions using specious reasoning. You seem to believe that Crystal Mangum was in full control and willfully committed herself to perjury in order to obtain money or "fame". You completely neglect or reject the concept that Crystal is coping with being mentally ill. During toxicology reports, she was found spaced out on drugs and her history pointed to her selling her body for money (presumably to obtain more drugs). Further study in these categories only pointed more towards abuse and problems. Imprisoning people for being crazy solves neither the prison problem nor the problems associated with mental illness.

    It's important to distinguish a few things here, among them what typically constitutes a rape case, and lack of evidence vs. evidence of lack. Generally rape cases largely suffer from he-said she-said, because often the female doesn't immediately report the crime and the crime scene tends to be difficult to construct or easily destroyed. So a female coming forward and asserting that she was raped with little / no evidence is neither malicious nor criminal, and may very well have been raped, as I assume we can agree upon. This brings us to my next point, and that is just because she suffered a lack of evidence, the D. A. was still in his every right to pursue the case. But once it became clear that there was an evidence of lack, the D. A. should have dropped the case forthwith.

    Crystal Mangum's claims should have been briefly investigated by the D. A. and dismissed as soon as it was clear that numerous claims she was making were patently false. That is, there was evidence of lack. Unfortunately, the D. A. did the exact opposite, and began concealing the evidence of lack and using Crystal's hearsay (remember, a substantial, legitimate, integral part of many rape cases) to mount more press coverage and pressure on the case.

    So in this particular case, that both you and DE are claiming was a product of Crystal's doing, is only in a very small part Crystal's doing. She was simply providing the claims, and the D. A., knowing full well that many were false, was making the case out of nothing. Can we really level the full brunt of what happened at Crystal M. with some criminal charges and wash our hands? Can we really claim that a mentally ill woman with histories of abuse and drug use is going to be "fixed" by years in jail? The fact remains that absolutely none of this would have happened if the D. A. had acted within the proscribed means of his job's charter, and acted ethically. As he did not, he was fired, disbarred, and the case dropped. A hobo on the street yelling in front of a hospital that doctors inside planted a device in his brain to control him should no more be clapped in jail than Crystal M.; the only difference is a D. A. supported Crystal M.

    Prosecuting Crystal M. would not facilitate the lessening of premeditated false rape accusations (a sick, arguably insane act), but it may frighten some ignorant rape victims out of testifying for fear of prosecution. Thus, no good comes from putting Crystal M. in jail for her part in the process, which would have never occurred if it had not been dishonestly supported by legitimate government politicians pursuing an agenda.

    Edit: And I just read up on her "murder" charge to which you alluded. She was in a domestic dispute with her boyfriend, in which he started fighting with her because she set his clothes on fire in a bathtub. She threatened to stab him. They brought 10 different charges up on her because of it. Justice?
    Last edited by Bodhi; 02-24-2010 at 09:38 AM.
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    Default Re: Why isn't Crystal Mangum in prison?

    One reason to put people in jail is to hurt them (retribution), the other is to deter the public and the third is to stop them from comitting further crimes. I wouldn't be too quick to say that locking up the mentally deranged isn't just. You just need a different program for them and luckily we do have a such a thing.

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    Default Re: Why isn't Crystal Mangum in prison?

    I'm sorry but that post was so piss poor as to not warrant a response. Not only do you never address anything I said, you go off on a tangent inferring that my position is something other than what I just spent 5 paragraphs explaining; I'm fairly certain that at no juncture did I ever state or even imply that "locking up the mentally deranged isn't just". If I were grading posts, that one would get a big, fat F.
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    Default Re: Why isn't Crystal Mangum in prison?

    You adressed the fact that it would be wrong to lock her up due to her being mentally ill and you placed most of the blame on the prosecution.

    I mentioned the three functions, because you did adress the retribution, you made a contentious assertion about the prevention of pre-meditated false rape charges (statistic?) however you basically brushed over the function of locking her up to protect us from her. Locking her up for that purpose isn't unjust, which is what you seem to be asserting when you refer to her capacity as a ground for not punishing her.

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    Default Re: Why isn't Crystal Mangum in prison?

    I have no idea what you're trying to assert, frankly because your posting is so half-assed and terse as to be functionally useless. I explained my position very carefully, and the justification for it. Mental patients need not be jailed for having delusions, as I asserted and apparently you are taking contention. Locking up people with delusions will not take away their delusions nor are delusions themselves a clear, present danger to the public at large.

    In the case of the Duke lacrosse players, the trial and the resulting fallout would have never made the news nor would it have even been remotely noteworthy if there were not a dishonest prosecutor fanning the flames with unscrupulous statements at every turn. I am not some nutjob just randomly assigning blame on the D. A. to "save" Crystal Mangum as you are so disingenuously implying; the D. A.'s behavior was examined and ruled upon by the BAR, and it was found to be so grossly improper and lacking as to disbar him from a career in law.

    At any given time there are a thousand people that have mistaken the identity of their attacker or the exact details, due to causes from downright accident to completely insanity. This does not mean that the prosecutors of varying states need go on a crusade to prosecute these mistaken accusers. In order to do so, they would first have to be able to prove mens rea to a reasonable extent, and obviously if these people are not of sound mind they cannot provide such.

    ...I could keep going, but I'm just repeating myself. If you can't be bothered to write an intelligent, coherent post I'm going to stop wasting my time. Please form a point, clarify your point, provide examples, and illutrate it clearly.
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